Do you really want the financial freedom to do what you want when you want? Are you willing to make sacrifices today so you can be free tomorrow? If you aren't willing to delay gratification, I'm not sure you want financial freedom bad enough.
In 2009, with the launch of Financial Samurai, I kickstarted the modern-day FIRE movement. It has now grown to be a worldwide phenomenon where millions of people maximize their saving rate and invest aggressively to retire early.
But I've also seen a growing number of complaints about how the FIRE movement is crazy and it's no way to live from people who very much want financial freedom. What gives? Let's use a student debt issue as an example of this conundrum.
Pay Back Your Student Loans And Do The Right Thing
I don't think we have a student debt crisis so much as an entitlement crisis. There used to be a time when paying back your debt with interest was done with honor. There would be no complaints, but simple gratitude for someone or some organization willing to take a risk on you. I think people don't want it bad enough.
Nowadays, it seems like there is a growing movement of folks who believe there should be debt forgiveness just because. Just because what? Seriously, please tell me or write a guest post explaining why you are entitled to free money.
Being a debt welcher demonstrates bad character. If you're not willing to scrub toilets, drive a car, get up at 5am to work extra hours, or flip burgers to pay your debts or get out of a bad financial situation, then you are going blame the world for your problems until you die.
Financial Freedom: Do You Want It Bad Enough?
Here's a comment from the Average Student Debt At Record High post I'd like you to read.
I went to a private college and got a BS and MS in engineering. School left me in $88K of student loan debt upon graduating. This would have been more, but I was working multiple jobs throughout college to afford the $40K/yr price tag. Like some others have said, the FASFA really screwed over my family. It valued their house at an insane amount even though they had a substantial mortgage. I’m pretty sure it also looked at my parent’s retirement accounts as assets that could be liquidated, but that was not an option.
Anyway, after graduating with $88K in debt, I continued to work 2, 3, 4, and even 5 jobs at a time to make as much money as possible. My first real job started at 50K but has risen to just over 100K in six years. Even though I am making this money now, I am still working side hustles to make extra money, and can easily make an extra $2-300 a week with minimal work from home, mostly through websites like fiverr, crowdsource, and other freelancing platforms. Sometimes I still help out at a friend’s restaurant waiting tables and can make $2-300 in a night!
On top of this, I also went back to school while doing all this work and got a professional degree in an unrelated field that is going to allow me to open up my own business on the side. I’m hoping that this will net me around $10,000 extra each year.
The thing that really resonates with me, though, is how few people are willing to put in the time, and to make smart life choices so that they can reach financial independence. With all this work, I was able to pay off my $88k in loans and finance a professional degree without taking out any new ones.
I also bought a house and have a very reasonable / manageable mortgage payment. I save roughly 20% of my income for retirement when you count the employer match. And, I still can go out for nice dinners, go to sporting events, go on a week or two of vacation each year, go to shows, have nice clothes for work and casual events, drive a decent car, and afford home improvement projects on my house.
Every time I hear some sob story about people who are stuck in debt from student loans, I also hear stories about how they waste money on useless wants, go on extravagant vacations they cannot afford, eat out at fancy restaurants for every meal, and sleep-in every chance they get. They never tell us they are working a second job, or how they are trying to save up for something. Instead, they are racking up credit card debt on top of student loan debt, complaining about it, and not thinking about the future at all.
We really need people in college and recent graduates to be more responsible for their own decisions. I think that is where the solution begins.
When You Want It Bad Enough You Make Sacrifices To Get Ahead
By working multiple jobs through college, multiple jobs after college, waiting tables while making $100K at his day job six years later, and diligently saving 20% of his income, it's clear this commenter WANTS to get ahead. He's not somebody who complains why he can't get ahead while working less than 40 hours a week.
I've highlighted Sean Cooper's story about how he put his life on hold for three years so he could pay off his mortgage early. No sex. No fine dining. Definitely no fancy car. No travel since travel is banned anyway. Forget about main house living. Lots of extra freelance work. And now, no mortgage debt. Sean wanted to get ahead, so he did it. Are you willing to make the same sacrifices to pay off your debt too?
The benefits of financial freedom sooner more than outweigh loose spending today. I could show you pictures of how awesome life is once you have absolute freedom, but that would just annoy you or make you feel bad. Hence, all I can do is just continue to write and share some examples of doing what it takes.
One More Example Of Hustle
In the post, Larks vs. Night Owls, another reason I decided to drive for Uber between 5am-7am was to get its year-end $750 bonus after 20 rides. You see, Uber ran a special last December where referrers would get a $750 bonus if they signed up a new driver (from $300 usually), and the new driver would also get a $200 bonus for a combined bonus total of $950.
Based on my 400+ ride experience, I knew I could do 3-4 rides an hour. In other words, after 6 hours of work, I could capture a $950 bonus + ~$200 in fares for a total of $1,150. That's an hourly rate of $192, while also being able to do research on early birds for my post.
A $192 hourly rate equals $33,280 a month, and $400,000 a year if maintained for 40 hours a week. Not bad, if you take advantage of the various opportunities. So many people are making way more money than anybody knows through side hustles.
Nobody Wants To Hustle Harder For Financial Freedom
What's interesting is that I gave my referral code to three friends, and none of them bothered to sign up to earn extra money, even if I told them I'd split the proceeds. All have nice cars (VW GTI, BMW 535i, and Porsche Cayenne), but none of them can afford a median priced single family home in San Francisco. Their house-to-car ratio for measuring fiscal responsibility is out of whack!
They bitch and moan about the cost of housing. One of them would rather let three of his doubles players wait for 45 minutes because he didn't want to pay $3.25/hour for parking! The person who did accept my referral code was my business partner. And she was smart to make me drive for her while she collected her $200 bonus for just being.
I've come to the conclusion that too many people are either too proud to make extra money or too lazy. They don't want it bad enough. Unless you have some physical or mental malady or come from a broken family, it's hard to except so many excuses when there's so much opportunity now. If you have family, please don’t be too proud to take care of them!
Remember this: It takes effort to see the sunrise.
Everybody is jealous of what you have, but nobody is jealous of what it took for you to get there.
For Financial Freedom, Don't Do Nothing
Please don't complain when others buy nice things, retire early, travel abroad, and live in fabulous places. They stayed on top of their net worth and work towards a financial plan.
Personally, I blew up my passive income in 2H 2023 by buying a forever home I didn't need with cash. I sold stocks and bonds, thereby reducing my passive income temporarily by $150,000.
After renting out my previous house, I'm still about $70,000 – $80,000 a year short of my $380,000 passive income target. Hence, my plan is to achieve financial freedom again by December 31, 2027. It's actually exciting to have a big audacious financial goal again.
Get your finances in order the easy way:
Want to be financially free and have a great retirement? You've got to want it bad enough.
Every single goal achiever put in plenty of sacrifice. If you want to be free, put in the extra work today. If not, I guess you can blame me or the President. But blaming won't get you anywhere.
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Children learn their spending habits and lifestyle based on what their parents can afford, and their parents, and their friends’ parents, can afford a lot because this is an awesome country. But they aren’t taught the skills to do this for themselves. So it’s a combination of all of the above: entitlement, lack of teaching, and cultural blindness. We are victims of our success, but we are to blame as well. But children grow up into adults. A child will understandably do bad things if taught to do so by their parents, but there comes a point when the child becomes an adult and the lessons don’t really matter. They are responsible for themselves.
But parents could make it easier simply having the conversation with their kids “You have a good life based on MY salary which is based on MY skills and credentials. When you turn 18 [or 22 with a shiny new degree] you are unskilled and your credentials non-existent so expect to eat a lot of ramen.”
I really wanted to go to a top school for my BS, but I’m so glad I went for the state school and scholarship. I found out later that jobs either don’t really care, or they want an MS. And if they want an MS they care about where you went for that, not your BS. And if the MS program is a right fit you should be sponsored anyway. I took out one small loan, deferred, at 2% because I could and that went into my down payment after I graduated.
This might sound cliche but it takes a village in some ways to raise a child. So many people influence a young adult’s views on money and debt. Universities have become expensive cocoons that extract a heavy price for a 4-year stay of a young adult walking in their hallowed halls. In the 90s Bill Gates famously said, Banking is necessary, Banks are not. Similarly, knowledge is necessary, expensive universities are not. As a senior executive who has interviewed hundreds of applicants for various jobs in my company, I found find the hungry, hard-working tier 2 or 3 university graduates who worked their way through college to be far better hires than those from top tier names who come saddled with $100k debt asking for similar salary!
Everyone “wants” financial freedom… but very few want it bad enough to actually take action and take specific steps that are needed to get there.
If you are currently saving less than 10% of your income, you clearly don’t want it bad enough. Otherwise, you would find a way to MAKE it happen.
Well my friend there are definite generation changes.
The feelings of entitlements didn’t exist in our parents generation, but do now.
Tuition has increased by how many 100%s from our parents generation. My parents worked one year during school and ended up affording a car and paying for FOUR years of tuition. Today that is impossible because the the rate of tuition increase is exorbitant while rate of wages is turtle pace.
Some things are better with time, other things have changed for the worse over time.
I think much of the “crisis” you are addressing comes back to the pervasive culture of excess. It’s nothing new, humans have sought to one-up each other for centuries. Our competitive nature has caused mass droves of people to buy into consumerism in a pursuit of winning out over their neighbors. This has only gotten worse as we have added in the element of “self reward,” buying things as a way to reward ourselves for our hard work (at a job we likely hate) because we “deserve it.” I know because I was one of those people just a few months ago.
Discovering “the truth,” that buying things won’t make you happy and that you don’t have to slave away at a job you don’t like until you’re 65, is not an easy message to get across. This is especially true for the majority of people who, I think, are most comfortable when someone else will tell them how to live their life. Most people are more than happy to take their guidance from friends, family and mass media who perpetuate these myths. It takes a certain amount of intelligence and independent thought to break free, to swallow the red pill. I consider myself lucky to have met very little resistance from friends and family (although I sense most of them think this is a “phase”) and also lucky to have married someone who was just as easily convinced to see the big picture once I revealed it. Now we look at each other every day and ask “Why did we ever think that was the right way to live?” and then “How do we bring others on board?”
The answer, in our short experience, is that you can’t force these concepts on other people. They have to discover it for themselves or see it in action. Just in the past 2 months we’ve traded down to an electric vehicle, stopped mid-build on a massive custom home and are now looking to sell our current home and downsize to half of what we live in now. We’ve cut expenses in almost every area we can and are looking at our budget each month to find where we can cut back further. The more we cut expenses, the faster we can save and the earlier we can retire because we’ve learned to live with less. This is the example we set for those around us – I tell everyone I know that I’m going to retire in 10 years (or less) as a way to make myself accountable to my goals.
Well said, and I agree. I hope you meet your retirement goal in 10 years or less!
Here’s a follow up post: Why Tough Love Is So Important In Personal Finance
I’m a little embarrassed to admit that I may not be doing everything I can to reach financial independence as soon as possible – from reading this post. I definitely have used excuses (too tired from shift work, not having as many opportunities for side hustle in Canada, not wanting to leave my comfort zone…etc) and I feel like I’ve given these excuses too much power to stop me.
I’ve gained more insight of myself after reading this. Truth hurts!
I’d love to side hustle and get ahead, but the problem is that I’m a foreign worker from China, and my visa is tied to my employer. If I earn any active income outside of that, I would be in violation of immigration law. That includes working for another company, this is the obvious one, but also driving Uber, hosting on Airbnb, consulting, and freelancing. Even if the work is location independent, like blogging or YouTube.
My stepbrothers and I are worlds apart, and some of it does come down to entitlement. The eldest was too lazy to apply for guaranteed scholarships from an in-state school since his dad can afford to cover in-state out of pocket. But it’s also about not understanding money and how hard you do need to work to pay it off. My student loans shocked me, and they are fairly minimal, and my degree is in science, but didn’t come with a lot of marketable skills. I built those on my own (coding, leadership, analytics), on accident. Universities don’t always do a great job preparing students with real skills.
Otherwise, as an immigrant, I think some comes down to the fact that it’s common to be told that you weren’t brought to this country to continue doing menial tasks. My first job was undergraduate research and tutoring, since I didn’t have work authorization before that (to be fair, I volunteered at a pizza place many weekends to raise money for a school activity before, but it wasn’t a ‘real job’). I definitely think if I had been a server or worked more jobs like this when I was younger, I would have had the drive for financial independence earlier.
I’m just very happy I did not apply for any out of state universities and got free tuition through scholarships. Even now, my student loans have an impact on my financial freedom, which is what ‘awoke’ me financially and got me hustling to pay those off ASAP. But it makes me appreciate my education more. I just wish I had been doing it all along.
I think there’s societal pressure to go to the best school you can get into, regardless of the cost. It’s the same type of message as needing to get the best marks possible. It’s as though that’s a necessary ingredient to success. I had the same pressure put on me for my MBA, given I was usually at the top of my class, and I just refused to spend $100K for my masters. I stayed at home, did it for $30K (less $10K in grants and scholarships I hustled for) and worked part-time during part of my studies, despite my mother offering to foot the bill. I also used money I saved up so that I could afford transportation and parking on my own dime. That meant that I could finish school without breaking the bank. Sometimes, just because society pressures us to go for broke doesn’t mean we have to make that choice. After all, we’re the ones who need to live with the decision.
Most all 20-something folks I have met in recent years are in that entitled crowd and are complete clueless about life and responsibilities… I don’t know.. did their lack of having good parents fail them?? did their formal education steer them wrong?? are they just lazy??? I think it is the first and the latter… Create good goals and achieve them.. life can be simple… and awesome at the same time… with lots of challenges in the mix when you are killing it…
I think there’s definitely some validity to the entitlement issue. But like some commenters, I do think you kind of overlook the costs of education and give a pass to those who are profiting off the backs of students. I took out student loans for undergrad but it was a state school so it wasn’t too bad. I took out the max Stafford loans for law school but I worked full time while attending in the evenings part-time so that my loan burden wasn’t as bad. I could pat myself on the back and say that others should work harder rather than complaining. But I think there is a genuine issue when law schools charge $50,000 and tout their great employment record for grads and $150,000 start salaries at firms when in actuality, many grads with huge amounts of student loan debt will make $40,000 to $60,000 as an entry level attorney. Some may not even be able to get those jobs and have to do temporary document review. Maybe they can work hard and move up…Nope…that type of job will not help you move up or out. There’s also an issue with the interest rates on student loans….federal loans at 6.8% and private loans in double digits, when mortgage rates are under 4%?! Collateral? Well student loans are not dischargeable in bankruptcy so there’s a good chance that if a person can pay, they will.
As a lawyer, what are some solutions you can think of to help other lawyers? I’ve read that lawyers are one of the most unhappy group of people due to the cost of education, time it takes to be a lawyer, work hours, and job overall. I’ve heard this since 1995 when I graduated high school. It deterred me from going the law route.
Also, I’ve always thought lawyers were some of the smartest people because they had to get the best grades to get into the law schools. Can we make a conclusion that good grades and smarts is only loosely correlated with good financial habits? It’s not like law students are those who went to go fight a war and are being convinced by private online for private colleges to pay big tuition so they can have a chance at a future propaganda.
Good question, I don’t know the answer as I’ve been “fortunate” to not have the soul sucking job that many attorneys have. I have a government job which okay pay and best of all…decent hours and no need to find clients. As for being the smartest people, I don’t know about that. You may have to have the best grades to get into law school, but there are many lower tier schools (that charge the same as the top ones) where it is much easier to get in. I think it’s a common misconception for many people going the law route that they all make tons of money. There are the top grads from top schools who make the big money: https://www.nalp.org/class_of_2013_bimodal_salary_curve
But many start off much lower and there is very little in between.
I recently saw a GoFundMe set up by an average guy who was looking to have everyone else pay off his student loans. His thought, based on the summary, was: hey, if I can get X number of people to put in just $10 I can pay these off. It actually made me a little sick to my stomach and was glad that no one had contributed to it. People need to take responsibilities for their finances and actions. But I do believe there is a lack of education when it comes to personal finance. There really should be a mandatory lesson/class on basic finance that is taught in every high school.
Speaking of entitlement, I cannot believe what some college students expect to get paid at their first job.
A few months ago a group of my friends and I were hanging out when the topic of financial goals came up. The discussion covered prospective job opportunities, life goals for our 20’s, living expenses, college loans, things like that. When it came my turn to share, I was immediately told “good luck, you’ll never achieve that with your degree”. To be honest, I just sat there speechless. For those of you wondering, my degree is in a physical science.
Apparently, because I wasn’t going for one of the “BIG” degree’s, I was never meant to make any money. While, albeit, my proposed financial goals were ambitious, they were in my opinion very achievable. What nagged me the most though about the conversation was the simple fact that I already had a higher income than they did. I have the highest GPA. I have taken out the most student loans because I’m practically paying for all of college.
For the last few years, I have sometimes gotten annoyed at how it always feels like I put in the most effort in school while everyone else skates by. Working double time to get the highest GPA possible. Working a job for extra money. Or, how I’ll be paying off way more student loans than most people.
Yet, as I have gotten older, while the feelings of annoyance have not diminished, new feelings have started to appear. I have begun to feel pride in my independence. I now realize that life is give and take; and my success comes not from how much I take, but in how much I give to reach my goals.
Reaching the financial goals I proposed a few months ago won’t be easy. I know it will entail countless hours of hard work and then some. It will require many more gives than takes, but at the end of the day, no matter how rough it gets, it sure feels good to be independent.
Looking back, I do hope that everyone else reaches their proposed goals as well. But, as I have learned over the last few years of college, success is not how much you are entitled to, but how much you are willing to give up to reach your goals.
As Jon Krakauer said “It is easy, when you are young, to believe that what you desire is no less than what you deserve, to assume that if you want something badly enough, it is your God-given right to have it.”
“I now realize that life is give and take; and my success comes not from how much I take, but in how much I give to reach my goals.”
I enjoyed this point. I can’t tell if you are in college now, or have graduated. Either way, do know that you will gain no greater satisfaction than being independent to pay your own bills, make your own decisions, and strive to live the life you want. Having the ability to choose is priceless.
This is something I need to remind myself more —
Things do not happen on their own. I need to MAKE things happen in my life.
I need to earn my own success.
I feel like this is also a great lesson on trade offs.
We can have anything, but we cannot have everything. Something has to give, right?
Speaking of entitlement, did you see the recent story of the woman suing her law school, because she couldn’t get a job when she graduated?
She is blaming the school for over inflating its employment figures.
And while I certainly agree that a school, or any business, should be held accountable for accurate performance reporting (obviously a big deal in the investment world), holding the school responsible for her getting a job seems far-fetched.
A lot of comments seem to student loan focused, with several people bringing up a perceived injustice that student loans can not be vanquished through bankruptcy, when other types of loans can.
Perhaps we should keep in mind that student Loans are not secured by anything. If you welch on your mortgage the lender can seize an asset (your house) same with a car loan etc, but a lender can’t seize your education. So in order for a lender to take on this additional risk, there needs to be SOME form of an incentive. One option could be that student loans could be treated like any other unsecured personal loan, which would result in much much higher rates. Another option is the current treatment, that they can’t b vanquished through bankruptcy. A borrower can’t just demand that they be able to get student loans at artificially low rates, while still having all the protections of other loans… There is no free lunch… just b/c you want it doesn’t mean you are entitled to it.
From my perspective the problem with student loans is that unlike just about any other kind of loan, there is no evaluation of the borrower’s ability to pay back the loan. When you apply for a mortgage a lender analyzes your credit score, income, existing debt, etc. for the purpose of establishing your ability to service the loan. Any weakness will drive higher rates as the borrower represents higher risk. Additionally the lender goes through the appraisal process to reach a conclusion as to whether the asset (the house) is of sufficient value the justify the loan in question (the mortgage). Why don’t we do this for student loans?
As an example, someone seeking a $20k loan for the purpose of getting an engineering degree from MIT should have a high likelihood of approval, and at a favorable rate. This would be driven by the low risk profile associated with servicing the debt as only a moderate amount of debt is being taken out, and the degree will likely yield a high starting salary, as well as a high value of the asset (the engineering degree from MIT).
Conversely, someone seeking a $100k loan for the purpose of getting an art history degree from the University of Phoenix should have a high likelihood of being denied, or only approved at exceptionally high rates. This would be driven by the high risk profile associated with servicing the debt as only a high level of debt is being taken out, and the degree will likely yield a low salary, as well as a low value of the asset (the art history degree from the University of Phoenix).
Of course people would throw a fit about any such analysis due to the “entitlement crisis” that makes everyone think they are entitled to be able to “follow their dreams” and get whatever education they want, regardless of how irresponsible it might be.
Thats a real issue, and its why private institutions should mostly stay out of the primary student loan market. It was also a big issue before the ability to refinance was there just a year or two ago. You now had professionals with loans that were double the going rate with good incomes and credit that couldnt change the situation.
While the subject/school part is intuitive, it would likely cause massive distortions in the market and just be too difficult to implement properly. The government should have been much stricter and not allowed these for profit, obviously inferior diploma mills to pop up and just fund them indiscriminately, that was a failure.
These reasons, and the ultimate over arching societal benefit are why government should be the one on the hook for the primary student loan market. There should definitely be some form of real financial education about value, etc…before taking them out, and something done on their side about not promoting rapidly inflating tuition, though that seems to have come to a head already.
Im not for the blanket bankruptcy allowance, it would be abused like mad, but I am for 100% tax deduction on all payments.
I really don’t think there’s an issue until serious talk of “write off the debt” happens. THAT is a crisis.
The moral hazard on that is pukeasaurus rex (Shakespeare created 1000’s of words…that’s one of mine haha).
Big issue is…as a country we are projecting each interest group’s values on other people. For example, while I agree with you and share your views here on FS in almost 100% entirety…one thing I notice or feel (and again it’s just the way it lands on me) is that sometimes it’s easy to look at “data” and automatically assume we know the answer or that it applies to everyone.
I think the bigger issue is not how much a person makes or saves…but rather if they’re rational and say “I make $4k a month and I should spend less than that or else I’ll be broke/in debt” then that’s ok. I think you probably feel the same since you’re super rational and logical.
But sometimes I think it’s easy to assume (and I see this a lot in blog comments here) that people all share the same values. I see readers assume your premises are faulty (especially when I read the “don’t spend more than X% of your net worth on your car” article that was full of haters) or assume it’s not possible.
I laugh at all the dumb spending I did in my 20’s. Granted it’s not drinking or drugs or whatever…but just depreciation/interest on cars alone is disgusting. I had to “unlearn” my belief that used cars were junk and it took me buying 4 new cars in 11 years to do it. Oh well live and learn.
But now…I find that it’s easy to live comfortably on 3500-4k net (after taxes and debt paydown) and honestly probably couldn’t figure out what to do with money beyond that. We eat at Chipotle whenever, have fun, watch/go to movies, and can easily pay for our kiddo on that. Life is good.
So, I’ll say this…it’s always a slippery slope projecting values on other people. Media does it a ton with how they portray millenials. Same with the boomers. America is a great place to live and has probably more immigration than the next 10 countries put together. They wouldn’t be coming if there was a crisis or negative situation.
We have a crisis of perception/marketing not in the data in my opinion.
Entitlement certainly has something to do with it. I’ve had an entry level employee complain about his $31/hr wage when the guys next to him were making $45 and $108(both different departments on the same project). He thought he should be getting at least as much as them because he does so much work and they sit around. When actually he’s got one year experience and the $45/hr employee has 4 and is a supervisor while the $108 is a contract worker that’s providing his own equipment(which is factored into the rate) and is also a supervisor. The worse part is he’s not the only one that doesn’t realize their place as an entry level employee.
Nothing pisses someone off more than someone who isn’t willing to pay their dues when others have!
Because it’s Friday, I’m just gonna say ya don’t gotta give up sex to get ahead. :-) In fact, going hard to get what you want is sexy as hell! Hats off to Sean Cooper for his monkish devotion to the cause, but…damn, don’t make it harder than it needs to be.
Wow – lots of comments to this post. Cool. It’s encouraging to see people refusing to step into the long, slow line of chained suckers shuffling their way to normal.
Are kids entitled? Of course they are. They’re entitled from the first time they grope for mama’s milk. We all were. But then we started grow up and someone taught us we actually had to DO shit to GET shit and if we didn’t, well, sit down and shut up already! “Oh, but that hurts my self esteem!” Huh? Your self-what? Sounds like you need something to DO. Go make yourself a trophy.
From 1st grade, financial management and basic economics should be woven into math and social studies. I was hanging out with my college daughter and her friends a while back and mentioned my daughter – who is pretty good with money and contracts – had asked me to give her a crash course on managing money and investing. I was surprised when all of them kinda looked at each other and said, “Uh, hey, any chance we could get in on that?” No one ever taught them. Looks like I’ve got me some students!
Oh, and if I were allowed to wave the change wand some more, I’d also require kids to study abroad with exposure to a developing nation. India, much of central & south America, lots of options in Asia etc. That college daughter still talks about our no-plans trip in northern Mexico when we walked across the border and took public transportation to get around. She was 7. The lasting image of a girl her age in rags begging her for money helped burn the edges off her sense of entitlement.
Keep going hard for what you want! Get laid a lot! And thanks for helping others step out of the long sad line to normal. Happy Friday.
Quite frankly, I appreciate that the Government was willing to extend me the money (as loans) so I could attend SUNY to get my undergraduate degree. Later, when i was working, i again used these programs so I could get 2 masters degrees (MBA and MQF). I grew up disadvantaged and my parents had NO financial resources to support any of this. Without these programs (and my savings from HS jobs) I would not been able to afford STATE school. I was accepted to Cornell and others – however it just was not in the cards. Now? I have paid back my loans – I honored my contracts – and I fully recognize without these programs I would not have been able to be as successful as I am know. I was always going to pay it back no matter what (and I have always paid all my debt). Sacrifice – even know when I am making a significant amount of money – is something that I live with daily so I can have the resources that are really important to me. I live in a home that is smaller than I should, drive cards that are have less “prestige”, go on lower-scale vacations, and save for the future. Some people say maybe I am missing out on life – well I value my time and children and financial security more than consumerism. Sometimes I look back and thank my lucky stars I grew up poor and without any means, I truly feel it makes me appreciate everything more and makes me always prepare for the worst.
Regarding entitlement specifically – it blows my mind how some people think they deserve certain luxuries when they can’t afford them. I know someone who is drowning in debt because she treated her HELOC almost like play money for decades and wonders why she has no money left. Nobody “needs” an $80 gym membership, cable TV, newspaper subscriptions and salon appointments but she thinks she does. At least now she is starting to make changes and be better about what she spends her money on.
Had a situation just like this recently when talking with a family member who was lamenting to me about not being able to find a full time job in her field and not having enough money to pay her credit card MINIMUMS. It went something like this:
“You already have one part time job. Why not get another one while looking for a full time job?”
“I don’t have the time for that.”
“Why not consider selling your car? It’s worth around $15,000”
“I’m not gonna sell my (insert luxury car model) and drive around in a piece of junk”
“Why don’t you consider cutting down your TV package? You hardly even watch TV.”
“I have a lot of shows on my DVR I need to catch up on I can’t get rid of those.”
Needless to say this was an enlightening look into the mind of an excuse maker but also a mind numbing exercise at the same time. Most people love making excuses about not being able to get ahead.
As my high school math teacher said to students who had crazy excuses about why they didn’t do their homework, “If you put as much effort in doing your work as you do in your excuses, you would be a lot better off.”
I have to say I agree with Willow above. While I applaud the hustle of the poster you quoted who worked multiple jobs to pay down the $88k in student loans, I was also wondering why so many other jobs were necessary while making 100k per year. I realize that certain places (like the San Francisco area) are terribly expensive, but so many side-hustles still seemed overkill. As a college professor (in the humanities, not in a STEM field), I never expect to make 100k. But I was able to pay off my student loans and live a comfortable life driving around my little not-luxurious hatchback, packing my leftover lunches to bring to campus, cooking elaborate meals in for dinner parties, etc.
As you both say, it is indeed about “choices and trade offs,” and, I would venture to add, our definitions of what constitutes a good life.
Hi Sam. I’m not sure I agree with the premise of the question. I think you can be financially independent without working 60 hours weekly. It’s about choices and trade offs. For example, if you want to move to San Francisco and pay $3500 for a one bedroom apartment, eat out two to three times a week at the latest hipster restaurant and drive a BMW then you probably do need to work those longer hours. However it may be possible instead to live in Oakland/Berkeley for $2600, eat out less, or at more affordable places, and drive an Acura and save yourself 20 hours to connect with friends and family.
I have luckily not worked 60 hours over a sustained period. I’ve done it for short periods and have been miserable. Obviously the more you work, the more you potentially have for later in life. However, I’d rather take that time now.
BINGO! “It’s about choices and trade offs.”
We must take OWNERSHIP of the choices and trade offs we make. If we decide to take on massive debt, not finish school, or whatever, we must own up to resolving our decisions and not rely on others to resolve them for us.
I think it’s overly convenient to think of people being entitled. I graduated undergrad with no debt, went to a top 20 law school and had to fund it entirely with student loans. Although the cost was ludicrous ($56,000 a year) I justified it based on supposedly vetted measures like US News & World Report claiming 99% of the graduating class was employed with a median salary of $135,000. Not only did that situation change, it later came out those numbers were a complete fabrication (the real numbers closer to 55% at a median of $70k). Meanwhile, the legal market tanked, most of my class who even found jobs were forced to take unpaid internships during law school so we couldn’t work side jobs or we would never get law jobs. I don’t know about others but between journals, moot court, classes and internships I would say 80 hour weeks were the norm for me.
I have little patience for people upset they can’t find jobs after a few applications (Oh my god 50 didn’t do it?!) I tracked my Applications though and without exaggeration applied to over 1750 jobs. I finally got one working in house at a fortune 100 company, but guess what? My loan payments if I wasn’t on some income based repayment plan would cover 93% of my take home pay. My loans are at a truly idiotic rate of 7.25%( they are all federal loans, that was the federally mandated rate when I went to school) and have ballooned to over $300k. Meanwhile, at my job WR are expressly prohibited from moonlighting because I’m expected to always be available. That means no adjunct teaching and no side law practice, and even no uber because my employer is one of the largest in the area and it would be impossible to do so discretely.
This is all a long way of saying it’s unfair to classify younger people as lazy and wanting their loans forgiven. Free University is a total joke, of course, but the prices have gotten out of control. In state tuition at my local state school will still leave you $50k in debt even if you’re able to work and cover living expenses. All this for a job that won’t pay the bills.
I think the student loan market should be shut down. It would force these schools to stop charging insane rates that lead to a future of indebted servitude. But I’m a little tired of the “lazy” label when the truth is its just depressing to have been scammed so hard. There is no universe where I will ever make enough to pay off these loans. In the past schools were less costly, loan rates less onerous. I think anyone over 40 should try and hold their tongue until they look into it further, because the truth is the situation is vastly different than it used to be
A 7.25% interest rate for a student loan IS A JOKE when the 10-year bond yield is at 2% or less. This is why there is an entire industry of financial tech companies like SoFi who are trying to lower the cost of debt for consumers. I hope you check them or another fintech lending company out b/c you should be paying under 4%.
Trying to get consumers, borrowers, and financial freedom fighters to SEE all this disconnect, and SHOW them how to improve their situation is one of the things I try to do on FS.
This is not a Millennial Focused post. This is a post focused on finding alternative ways out. You are not lazy if you are busting your ass and not welching on your debt while having a job.
There are definitely systemic issues. In med school/residency any questions about the feasibility of loan repayment was immediately quelled with, it wont matter its no big deal. While it will eventually be paid off, it is a big deal.
The way the loans incentivized exaggerated costs is terrible but there are simple ways to make it better now. It would be beneficial to make 100% of student loan payments tax deductible, making paying incentivized, freeing up capital for household formation and consumption, etc…Lots of ways to intelligently make headway to the wrongs that have occurred, and approaching keeping it from occurring again, of course, none of that will happen.
Jd- im sorry that happened to you. That could have happened to anyone. There is a large componant of luck involved. The people who graduated right into the great recession really got a bad break on account of nothing they had control over. Hang in there, bro. You will make it.